Khardenor - Testing traditional map elements

[Abu Lafia]

Khardenor.jpg
Yesterday i doodled a small map, where i tried to apply a more traditional style inspired by the always magnificent works from tainotim. I think it works much better for a sort of "inworld" map for gaming purposes than the way i do my maps usually.
With parts of the mountains and the coastal waves i'm rather happy, although i think i need a lot more practice on the trees and city icons. Generally i think the linework is still a bit too "dense" in my view and overall way too sloppy. But i like the result enough to keep on poracticing.

Colors and labels in Gimp

Would love to hear your thoughts, critique, suggestions for improvement, etc.
Hope you enjoy!

AL

[arsheesh]

Well I wouldn't call the linework sloppy. Dense isn't necessarily a bad thing either, depending on what you are going for. Generally the thicker the line the less "realistic" the end result will look. So if you are going for something with more of a cartoon look then a thicker stroke is just the thing. If that is the goal here I think the results look pretty good, though I would work on tapering the strokes a tad more. Also I agree that the trees and icons look a bit too dark but this could be offset by drawing them larger next time. I know some people are sticklers for keeping proper proportions between terrain features but since cartoons are by nature exaggerations of actual objects I think a bit of stylistic license is perfectly fine in these sorts of maps.

Cheers,
-Arsheesh

[ThomasR]

Seems like you did all the linework with one pen. It could help to vary the thickness either by using a beveled pen and rotating it or going for a nice set of micron pens. I use 0.5 (mainly rivers and sometimes coastline), 0.3 (general linework), 0.1 (big detailing like secondary mountain ridges) and 0.05 (fine works like mountains third ridges, coastal details or canopies) for my hand drawn maps. Bu as Arsheesh pointed, thickness is not an issue.
I'm a big fan of your waves and the frame is wonderful. I've got no beef with the rest of the linework that works pretty well. Only nitpick would be about filling. The little dots and short dashes work well but overcrowd the place a little bit. Maybe use less of them but with more purpose ... I realize this sounds like a critic but it's really just fine tuning. It's the hardest part for me and I always (almost) scan my maps before adding those details because I often ruin them.
It's a nice piece and I think it's great that you try new things ... with success

[Abu Lafia]

Well I wouldn't call the linework sloppy. Dense isn't necessarily a bad thing either, depending on what you are going for. Generally the thicker the line the less "realistic" the end result will look. So if you are going for something with more of a cartoon look then a thicker stroke is just the thing. If that is the goal here I think the results look pretty good, though I would work on tapering the strokes a tad more. Also I agree that the trees and icons look a bit too dark but this could be offset by drawing them larger next time. I know some people are sticklers for keeping proper proportions between terrain features but since cartoons are by nature exaggerations of actual objects I think a bit of stylistic license is perfectly fine in these sorts of maps.

Cheers,
-Arsheesh

Thanks for the detailed feedback arsheesh, i appreciate it a lot! You're right, i definitely going to draw a larger map next time, to reduce the "cartoonish" look a bit more. This first try was only ~ A5 format. About the proportions i'm not worrying not too much, since i orient myself on actual historical maps which generally have never been suspect of depicting mountains, hills and trees "symbolically" rather than "realistic" Indeed, i have to practice achieving tapered strokes more consistently with my pen. Thanks for the hint! Maybe it's about the inkflow of the particular pen i worked with or it's just about the proper handling of the tools. Still a lot to learn in this department...

Seems like you did all the linework with one pen. It could help to vary the thickness either by using a beveled pen and rotating it or going for a nice set of micron pens. I use 0.5 (mainly rivers and sometimes coastline), 0.3 (general linework), 0.1 (big detailing like secondary mountain ridges) and 0.05 (fine works like mountains third ridges, coastal details or canopies) for my hand drawn maps. Bu as Arsheesh pointed, thickness is not an issue.
I'm a big fan of your waves and the frame is wonderful. I've got no beef with the rest of the linework that works pretty well. Only nitpick would be about filling. The little dots and short dashes work well but overcrowd the place a little bit. Maybe use less of them but with more purpose ... I realize this sounds like a critic but it's really just fine tuning. It's the hardest part for me and I always (almost) scan my maps before adding those details because I often ruin them.
It's a nice piece and I think it's great that you try new things ... with success

Thank you for the feedback Thomas, much appreciated! I'd love to work with only one pen on this type of map, although i'll try a thinner one next time (or enlarge the size of the drawing as mentioned above, or both...). I agree with you about the filling (no worries, i usually prefer critique over praise, so, many thanks for that! ). I didn't have a clear "classification" of different types of landscape beforehand, so some came up in the process. Next map i'll try to use these symbols more planned and purposeful as you said. I'll definitely follow your idea to scan/copy the original map for trying different things without screwing up the original piece, very clever!

[Mouse]

Oh I was going to sing your praises, until I read what you said in response to thomrey! LOL!

I think its a great little map, and I fully agree with what Arsheesh and thomrey said in praise of it, but if you prefer critical analysis - I think it might be livened up a bit more by varying the colours - different greens/golds/mauves for mountains, forest, grassland, savannah, desert etc

[Josiah VE]

Looks wonderful! Definitely has an antique-ey vibe .
Maybe there's too many little dots everywhere. It's not bad, but just a tad cluttered. Other than that it's great!

[Ilanthar]

Nice map! It looks a bit like a warcraft or comic style map, imho. I like the color palette but I think it's a bit too uniform, though.

[Voolf]

Overall very nice map. One thing i dont like are too thick sea lines (near coast) to my taste. Colours are very appealing.

[ChickPea]

I think this is a lovely little map and I'd like to see more in this style from you. Since you love criticism(!) I have a couple of thoughts...

I think the texture 'dots' work well for the most part but there's maybe just a few too many. Maybe the mountains would have been better off without them. Not sure. Also, I'm not completely sold on the font choice & style. Arsheesh mentioned a 'cartoonish' look above. I think your font would work with that style, but the colours and general style here feel more antique than cartoon to me, so I'm not quite sure the font works.

Minor quibbles aside, I think this is a very attractive map and it leaves me wanting to see more.