Menzheim [an unusual commission]

[SteffenBrand]

Regarding the buildings outside the wall - I will concede that Chris did bring up that point when I sketched it and in the version I sent him those buildings were not present.
Perhaps if I was playing Dark Eye and knew more about the situations in the game it would change things for me. I had someone on DA say something similar.
I'll say this - if the city is in a state of war or is frequently attacked then I can see the point. But a successful thriving city that is growing will have buildings outside the walls and from what I've seen in many historical reconstructions the city often pushes past it's walls and does build near the walls... often it takes a while before they build new outer walls.
I think it also depends on what those walls are defending the city from - outside attackers, wolves, rampaging were-rabbits....

Haha, yeah, the typical threats... Actually you are right - kind of. We both were, it poses a risk, but it was done (and humans are often times not logical in what they do). Also it is true that it often took a while before a new wall was build around the cities again if they grew.

Jeez, leave the shadows in. It's much cooler this way! =)

Part of my family in America is stunned during visits here in Germany when they hear that a ruin can be around 1,300 years old. Time is perceived very different, when a nation is young, such as America - what I mean to say is this: Cities in Europe can be more than 2,000 years old, in this time things change A LOT!

By the way, if there is ever a need for a map of Menzheim I know of, I will refer to you for this (since I work for the company that produces The Dark Eye).
Best wishes, Steffen

[J.Edward]

I would agree with you. I do think that living outside of Europe, many do think about cities from the perspective of an outsider, certainly.
I will add this though, as I've had a number of comments on cities - the society and social structure of the city is very important in determining how the city would be built and what it would look like.
The presumption is that if a city looks like a medieval European city that all other factors mirror a medieval European city - and that may not be the case.
Not an argument to what you said at all Steffen, just an added point I wanted to make.

Many cities in the Americas, older native cities were not walled and it lead archaeologists and historians to make the inaccurate assumption that those ancient peoples were not warlike, which was wrong of course.
There is a lot that goes into a city. The mindset, culture and social structure of the people makes a big difference in how it is constructed. If the city is not a feudally controlled city, things related to walls may be a different story. A merchant collective, or a union of families... things other than a single ruling lord/family dynasty. Maybe it's a farmers collective, though they would likely not build large stone walls.
Just other things to think about.

I don't know anything about the Menzheim of The Dark Eye, so for this city everything I did was just arbitrary really.
And in that case your point would be well made.
But for a city like Haerlech - it has a history and culture that doesn't have anything to do with medieval Europe.
Okay... end of rambling.

edit - haha, yes, it looks so sad and flat without those shadows.

[Abu Lafia]

I had a few people on DA ask about using it for their Dark Eye campaigns. That's pretty cool. It's fun knowing people are gaming some of these maps.

I bet there are a lot Dunno if Chris told you, but Menzheim is a central spot in one chapter of THE most epic (and famous) campaign of the dark-eye world "Aventurien". This part is about a vampire hunt in a harsh northern province in deep winter There are still lots of GMs in dark-eye related forums sharing experience and background material for preparing the campaign. Lucky guys... we just had a rough pencil sketch of the town back then (but a lot of fun nonetheless!) XD

By the way, if there is ever a need for a map of Menzheim I know of, I will refer to you for this (since I work for the company that produces The Dark Eye).
Best wishes, Steffen

If they aren't planning a rework of the "Gezeichneten Kampagne" for the 5th edition already, you better push them Haven't bought DSA stuff for some time now, but for sure as hell i'd do if i could get a book with maps from you and John in it!

Cheers,
AL

[Domino44]

Thank you Domino.
Did you notice the Henge is also a compass rose?
Maybe it's too subtle...

I did soon after I posted my comment, that detail makes it that much cooler!

[Bogie]

Brilliant map! Glad you finished it!

[Ilanthar]

Yes, it's much better with the shadows... but honestly I would be already glad to get what you have without the excellent shadowing!

[J.Edward]

I bet there are a lot Dunno if Chris told you, but Menzheim is a central spot in one chapter of THE most epic (and famous) campaign of the dark-eye world "Aventurien". This part is about a vampire hunt in a harsh northern province in deep winter There are still lots of GMs in dark-eye related forums sharing experience and background material for preparing the campaign. Lucky guys... we just had a rough pencil sketch of the town back then (but a lot of fun nonetheless!) XD


If they aren't planning a rework of the "Gezeichneten Kampagne" for the 5th edition already, you better push them Haven't bought DSA stuff for some time now, but for sure as hell i'd do if i could get a book with maps from you and John in it!

Cheers,
AL

I would love to work with Steffen on some of this. That would be very cool.

I did soon after I posted my comment, that detail makes it that much cooler!

It's the little things.

Brilliant map! Glad you finished it!

Thank you Bogie.

Yes, it's much better with the shadows... but honestly I would be already glad to get what you have without the excellent shadowing!

Thanks Ilanthar.

[Chris]

Hey John,

great that you finished it! It looks awesome! Thanks again for the great work!

[J.Edward]

Hey John,

great that you finished it! It looks awesome! Thanks again for the great work!

Thank you Chris. I'm glad you commissioned it.
It was a pleasure working with you again.