WIP : Haerlech

[ascanius]

Also, fun little aside: Painters often put the light coming from the left because it reads more naturally for people who read text left to right. You might try putting the water at the bottom and see how that looks... while you're at it. Of course it's me but, if I were doing a bird's-eye-view of this place I would probably lean toward the water at the bottom so you get the extra higher-points-near-the-top aspect going for it. But I also like what you're doing with it, so ignore me.

You know, thats something I've wondered about. I've noticed that almost everyone has the sun comething fromt the left, It started to make me feel wierd because I always put it on the right. Thanks for the info my curiousity is quenched.

I think I understand what you're saying chashio. It's something I do that seems to put people off at times - mixing line drawing style with more realistic rendering style.
I think that's what your speaking about. It's a weird personal choice. Sometimes I do it, sometimes I don't.

It's not a problem with your choice in style or how your doing the map, it's more of a technical error. Your style looks very good and it works very well but it also allows for little technical problems to pop up but those problems can exist for any style. I just don't want you to change things thinking it's a problem with your style when it's not.

Well, sort of. I was looking at it more from an artistic perspective or, well, you'll see what I mean. You know the landscape painting rule that says "cool colors recede and don't put warm colors in the background because they'll jump forward off the page and kill the viewer" ... or something like that, haha! I'm very tired and have forgotten how to more accurately and succinctly explain my point (for anyone who is curious enough to read on, I apologize), but anyway... contrasting values can have a similar effect.

In this case, your solid black lines around the cliffs work better in the areas where there is a distinct change in value on either side (the natural edges of light and shadow) and also in the shadows where the value is the same on both sides but also darker so there's less contrast between the line and the stuff around it. It doesn't work so well in the areas where both sides of the line are lighter, like at the base of the cliff; it throws off the local depth perception, making it difficult for the eye to interpret. If you were to use some kind of technique to soften the lines in the "light|light" areas--perhaps using a thinner line to keep it consistent with other parts of the map, or using a broken line, or other options, it might help things read better while keeping your mixed line art / realistic style intact... which is quite nice and I'm going to sleep now.

This ^ is a much better explination than mine.

[J.Edward]

Chashio - I think that makes it clearer. The problem for me with that is that I draw all the lines before doing any color and so would have to go back, erase and redraw lines to fit afterwards. I'm not lazy, per se, but that makes me feel lazy right now. I can see what you mean, but will have to consider the time investment there.
Oh, I meant to add - no, I didn't know the landscape painting rule.

ascanius - I thought more people seemed to have the light coming from the top right. I don't know, maybe I'll have to investigate that on more maps. That's my default direction. I try to break out of that but it creeps back in when I'm not actively thinking about it.
As for the style thing, I would say it is somewhat a style issue. As I said to chashio, I draw all the lines first then do the color later. That is where the problem seems to lie.
I had this issue with doing weapon concept art. Eventually I just stopped using the linework because too many people seemed to have issue with it because of how they thought it looked. It's odd to me. With comic and anime art people are okay with the linework but for many other things they aren't. C'est la vie.

[Ilanthar]

That's a very interesting discussion about light and shadows. I chose to put the light on the right because it's the east on my map and prefer a "rising sun" light.

By J.Edward
With comic and anime art people are okay with the linework but for many other things they aren't. C'est la vie.

Actually, I like your maps partly because they have kind of a "comics" feeling.

[J.Edward]

Thanks Ilanthar.
You know, I didn't actually think about the physical sun and its transition across the sky.
That is something I should be taking into account as well. Thanks for that input.
It's surprising I didn't think about that... or maybe it's embarrassing that I didn't.

[Chashio]

I've seen all kinds of light angles on maps and it can of course come from any direction you desire. It makes more sense to me to use a natural direction for the region first, then decide which direction to orient the map based on the compositon and how the terrain elements read under the lighting - and I might go with morning or evening light depending on what feels right for the setting--but that works for me.

When I'm just sketching or experimenting I find that sometimes I put the light on the left and other times on the right, and it just depends on what my hand does naturally when I start. Some days I can't for the life of me draw the light on the side I intended to, which is very annoying but no matter how I look at it it just looks wrong.

And I do like your style very much. Didn't mean to imply that it doesn't work overall. Also not implying that you need to go back and rework anything... just pointing out the points that didn't work for me.

[J.Edward]

It's interesting to know how people work. You are thinking about things at the beginning that I often am not thinking about until later.
That is where some problems crop up for me at times. I sit down, sketch out the whole layout in pencil with no thought to the lighting.
Maybe that's partly because at that point i could light it from any direction. I guess it depends. If it's a more finished drawing then I will have decided and started to draw in shadows. But that only happens when I think the drawing will be done as a full finished drawing, not just a sketch that will be done as color later.

Haha, no worries chashio. I didn't take it that way.
I like these discussions because it brings up things I don't think about sometimes.
I don't always actively think about my process and workflow, but when someone brings up points like these it makes me think about how I work and why do I do it that way.

[J.Edward]

So along with everything else I'm doing I was trying to get some boats drawn up for Haerlech's harbor.
I started on a few. These are just some of the first. I really wanted the harbor to be full of all sorts of different boats and ships.
We'll see if my enthusiasm for that continues. I have a wide variety sketched up and will work on those when I can.
Shading has to wait until they are placed on the map, which means I'll have to shade every boat individually but what can you do.
Boat sample 01a.jpg

[Meshon]

Great ships! I'm really excited that you're going to put them in. I think it will add a sense of busyness and life and motion to the map. Not that I think those things are missing, just that it will add to what's already there. If that makes sense. Good grief, it's just a terrific map!

Did you use vector software for the ships? I may have missed it if you already said what tools you're using.

cheers,
Meshon

[Larb]

Won't the ships lose a lot of detail and definition when you shrink them down? It's usually an issue if I do something that big and detailed and then put it on a map. They look great though, by the way.

[J.Edward]

Thanks Meshon. No vector. Probably should have though. Drawn in PS.
Larb - we will see. The original map is really big. I can work some magic on them once they get worked into the map.
It may become a problem. Only time will tell. And then I will have learned a very valuable lesson about usage of time and all.